My New Dilemma - Disconnecting Blue Winch Rope

[Splash]

OK Team - Another doozy for you!

I have installed that new blue winch rope and I cannot disconnect it becuase it is always tight - only way is to let it ride the boat on the way off the trailer and into the water, and then becomes slack.

I hate this because it makes the winch go spastic and becomes dangerous for potential broken fingers/hands with rotating handle.

Yes, I can use the safety chain and then disconnect the winch rope but then that becomes tight as well (naturally).

Please help me solve this dilemma.


Splash

[frankgrimes]

Hi Splash - When you say it is always tight, are you referring to the rope "biting" into itself on the winch drum?(Or is your boat sliding of the trailer too easily?)

If not, you may need to provide more details, or perhaps a pic of what's occurring?

[skipalong]

hey mate have done the same thing you are able to get a quick release clip is like a shackle but has short string you pull and releases they are about 60 dollars but they work a treat

[Chimo]

Hi Splash

Sounds like you need an absailing "8" that allows you to easily control the boats movement off the trailer. You can use it to hold the boat while you take the safety chain off and while disconnecting the winch near the winch post or closer to the end of the trailer, you choose.

Then you can lower the boat into the drink at whatever speed you choose with full control and no dramas.

When its floating simply unloop the absailing line from off the bow bollard use your paynter (bow rope) to do whatever you want to do.

Been getting a 2 tonne-ish Vag off the Tinka like this for years as with a Powerwinch with its small emergency handle you would be winding for years and probably end up with broken wrists to boot. If you undo everything and being on a Tinka the boat would end up in Tasy as its goes off the trailer that fast.

If this isnt what your in strife with, as FG said, provide pics.

Cheers
Chimo

[Roughasguts]

I just use a bow rope,, tie that to me winch post, un wind about a foot of winch strap till the rope takes up the weight of the boat.

Then when ready pull the slip not from me bow rope. It saves swimming after the boat too, just about p!ss meself when I see blokes swim after there boat.

[RJ5023]

I've had the same problem (if I read you right) since I upgraded the trailer. Boat wants to get off as soon as it feels the slope of the ramp.

This has worked well for me for the past 2 years or so (similar to roughasguts, but no knots).

A couple of turns with the bow rope around the winch post on the trailer. Release the ratchet on the winch. Hold firm to the bow rope until the boat has rolled back enough to take up the slack. Remove the (now slack) winch rope from the eye bolt on the boat. Flip the bow rope turns off the trailer winch post. Away she goes while you let the bow rope loosely run out through your hands.

Is that the same problem?

See ya,
RJ

[pubgolf]

I just start the outboard with the leg in the drink. (trimmed up reasonably high water comin outta the tell tale)
Put it in gear (forward of course)
Lean over the front and undo the winch and safety chain
Back to the wheel
Out of gear
into reverse
Into the water
Easy as that

:thumbsup:

Rod

[Roughasguts]

Trouble with that idea Rod is it destroys the end of the ramp and moves all the gravel and sand rocks Etc.

So then next time the tide is out and you reverse of the end of the ramp well then your trailer is stuck with your wheels hanging in free water and your trailer is sitting hard on the ramp.

And that be One of the reasons I'm against driving your boat on the trailer.

[wilcara]

A couple of turns with the bow rope around the winch post on the trailer. Release the ratchet on the winch. Hold firm to the bow rope until the boat has rolled back enough to take up the slack. Remove the (now slack) winch rope from the eye bolt on the boat. Flip the bow rope turns off the trailer winch post. Away she goes while you let the bow rope loosely run out through your hands.


Freakin' brilliant.

I have the same problem as Splash but until now I have been too ashamed to say.

My last boat was a 7.0m and current is a 5.0m Quinny but the Quinny does up as tight as on the trailer. If I release the winch rope after putting the boat on, and tying down, the safety chain becomes taught which next time I go to launch - everything tight, shackle jammed up, and no slack to play with to release the boat properly with a bowline.

I will try the roughasguts and rj5023 method - much the same as releasing a horse really:).

[pubgolf]

Fair point Roughasguts
Never really thought of that
And yes i have had a trailer fall off the end of a ramp into the drink at a low low tide.
Maybe i caused that problem by driving on and off my trailer.
I probably should start to winch on and off at low tide.
But then again the ramp i launch from now just north of Cairns is covered in sand and mud so i might be doing other boaties a favour by cleaning it

:thumbsup:

Rod

[Splash]

Thanks boys...

Obvoiusly this a common problem and I'm glad I have raised it here....

I will try the ideas mentioned above and report back..

Another question - do u undo the safety chain before you reverse boat onto ramp?

Splash

[Roughasguts]

I don't splash.
I seen one guy that did at Swansea, but didn't have the ratchet on his winch and ummm well the winch strap spooled and the boat ended up making a big white line down the ramp. Easy to winch back on though the bow was still on the trailer. But still a mess was made of his transom.

[Roughasguts]

No worries Rod, you probably are cleaning up the area better.

Just got to know where the end of the ramp is, and does it drop gradually so you can stop or does it have a sharp ledge, then your doomed.
Well maybe not doomed but at least your not going to break any retreiving records.

[trueblue]

always keep the safety on until ready to launch the boat into the water. always put it back on before driving up the ramp - prevents accidental parking of the boat on the ramp if there is a problem with the winch cable.

I concurr with the comments above, one or 2 turns of your bow rope around the winch post will let you release the winch by holding the rope, and then you cane easily lower it down into the water in a controlled manner. used to do that with my old non-drive on trailer

cheers

Mick

[Angla]

I must be lucky. I just drive down till I can just get to the tow ball without getting the shoes wet. I then stand on the draw bar and release the locking clip and back off the winch strap and remove the clip. The Boat just sits there while I climb up using the winch post and grab rails. Motor down to submerge the pickup , start motor and wait for telltale. I then jump from the cockpit to the bait board and this gives the boat enough momentum to start rolling off slowly. I then trim the motor to keep it from hitting ground. I then tie up at the pontoon and quickly remove the vehicle and trailer from the ramp.

When I return, the trailer gets dunked until the rear wheels of the vehicle are just touching the water. I drive it on gently and bring it right up to the post, climb over the bow to the winchp post and then the draw bar while the motor is holding the boat on. Connect the winch strap and wind 1.5 tarns, clip the safety on and climb back onto the boat to turn the motor off and trim the motor up. Back downto the winch post and draw bar then climb around to the rear wheel and get down to the dry ramp. Jump in the car and drive up the the de rigging area.

It took me a few goes to find the sweet spot trailer depth for both the launch and retrieve but it is a 1 man job for me ALWAYS. I will let others park the trailer after launch to make it faster.

The boat is a Cruisecraft 575 outsider and I must say that some ramps have caused me a little difficulty with different angles and drop offs.

Good luck and I hope this helps someone.

Chris

[johnny roger]

Fair point Roughasguts
Never really thought of that
And yes i have had a trailer fall off the end of a ramp into the drink at a low low tide.
Maybe i caused that problem by driving on and off my trailer.
I probably should start to winch on and off at low tide.
But then again the ramp i launch from now just north of Cairns is covered in sand and mud so i might be doing other boaties a favour by cleaning it

:thumbsup:

Rod
how far north of cairns are you rod?

John

[johnny roger]

Freakin' brilliant.

I have the same problem as Splash but until now I have been too ashamed to say.

My last boat was a 7.0m and current is a 5.0m Quinny but the Quinny does up as tight as on the trailer. If I release the winch rope after putting the boat on, and tying down, the safety chain becomes taught which next time I go to launch - everything tight, shackle jammed up, and no slack to play with to release the boat properly with a bowline.

I will try the roughasguts and rj5023 method - much the same as releasing a horse really:).

wilcara,
i use a turnbuckle on the bow hook to secure my boat onto the trailer. it works pretty good. but get a stainless steel one with lock nuts on either end of the buckle. you can undo the turnbuckle while the winch is still in tension, then just let out the winch. the turnbuckle also works well holding the front of the boat down while towing on the trailer. everyone ties down the transom to the trailer. but the front isnt being tied down at all, only by the force of the winch which is acting in a more of a forward direction istead down to prevent the boat from bouncing up and down.
John

[2manylures]

I just use a bow rope,, tie that to me winch post, un wind about a foot of winch strap till the rope takes up the weight of the boat.

Then when ready pull the slip not from me bow rope. It saves swimming after the boat too, just about p!ss meself when I see blokes swim after there boat.

Same as that except I do piss meself but only in winter.

[northernblue]

I must be lucky. I just drive down till I can just get to the tow ball without getting the shoes wet. I then stand on the draw bar and release the locking clip and back off the winch strap and remove the clip. The Boat just sits there while I climb up using the winch post and grab rails. Motor down to submerge the pickup , start motor and wait for telltale. I then jump from the cockpit to the bait board and this gives the boat enough momentum to start rolling off slowly. I then trim the motor to keep it from hitting ground. I then tie up at the pontoon and quickly remove the vehicle and trailer from the ramp.

When I return, the trailer gets dunked until the rear wheels of the vehicle are just touching the water. I drive it on gently and bring it right up to the post, climb over the bow to the winchp post and then the draw bar while the motor is holding the boat on. Connect the winch strap and wind 1.5 tarns, clip the safety on and climb back onto the boat to turn the motor off and trim the motor up. Back downto the winch post and draw bar then climb around to the rear wheel and get down to the dry ramp. Jump in the car and drive up the the de rigging area.

It took me a few goes to find the sweet spot trailer depth for both the launch and retrieve but it is a 1 man job for me ALWAYS. I will let others park the trailer after launch to make it faster.

The boat is a Cruisecraft 575 outsider and I must say that some ramps have caused me a little difficulty with different angles and drop offs.

Good luck and I hope this helps someone.

Chris

Near enough to how I have always launched my boats Chris, if that is, they didn't need to be manhandled off.

[wilcara]

wilcara,
i use a turnbuckle on the bow hook to secure my boat onto the trailer. it works pretty good. but get a stainless steel one with lock nuts on either end of the buckle. you can undo the turnbuckle while the winch is still in tension, then just let out the winch. the turnbuckle also works well holding the front of the boat down while towing on the trailer. everyone ties down the transom to the trailer. but the front isnt being tied down at all, only by the force of the winch which is acting in a more of a forward direction istead down to prevent the boat from bouncing up and down.

With you on that - While I was setting up the rig and putting in everything nice and shiny I took off the gal d shackle on the safety chain and replaced it with a spiffy stainless snap hook. Once on I back the winch off a little as it holds the boat front down. Trouble starts when the undoing starts, I need to tighten the winch up to give me some slack to undo the snap hook, then the winch has to be would backwards because it has all teh boat weight on it.

I have been privately pondering this dilemma amidst great personal shame for some time, secretly searching for a solution. The bow rope gives it to me I think. Thanks, and I am so relieved to finally meet others who are afflicted with this terrible problem.

:-X

[Splash]

Thansk Wilcara.

Together, we will conquer our dilemmas! :-)

Thansk to all!

Splash

[wilcara]

You're a nice looking puppy there Splash....

[Chimo]

Hi Splash

The trouble that I found with taking a couple of turns around the winch post and lowering the boat with it was that as the post is on an angle the rope rides up and snags so you dont have the absolute control you may want or need when letting the boat out.

That was my issue which is why I went with the absailing 8 with one end secured to the tow bar of the truck (away from the winch ) and a short length tied to one of the eyes with the other line belayed thru the other eye to let the boat out or stop it if I wanted to.

Anyway if your going to moor you wont have to worry about if so whatever works is the way to go.

If you can pick up a second hand Air Berth they hold their value very well (about 12K for a 2300 kg second hand one vs about 17K new so when if you sell it you will get most of your $s back. The boss of AB lived down the road from me and is real good to deal with.

Air dock is another one (that are no longer made so you may get one even cheaper second hand with less back later) plus there are boat lifts, boat bunkers all sort of variations all of which to a greater or lesser extent will reduce the rate of destuction to your boat and motor if you leave it in the water full time.

At least in the new spot you should have better access to Outboard mechanics etc!

Cheers
Chimo

[Splash]

Thanks Chimo.

Can u send me a schematic of that absailing 8 idea. I can picture vividly what you are sayign re: tying rope to post and I don't like it. :-(

I missed out on the waterside property. :-((((((((((((((((

Listed (rental) for one day and gone that day!!!!!!!!!!! :-(((((((((((((((((((((

Geeeeeees!

Anyway, will have to keep searching. I move in 3 weeks time and have 2 months to find something suitable for me, family, dog and THE BOAT (of course).

Yes, at least Darwin will provide me with some civilisation for once...

I am enjoying my paid journey around Australia :-)))))))))))))))))))))

Catchya!

Splash

[Splash]

You're a nice looking puppy there Splash....

Thanks Wilcara. WOOF WOOF! :P :P :P :P :P :P :P

SPlash

[dnej]

Splash,just a thought,how about getting a removable handle for the winch.

In that way,you dont have to fit the paynter,untill the winch rope has lowered the boat to the waterline.

.In any case,you have to run out he rope,before you recover the beast, so it is done when you launch instead.
Regards David

[Splash]

Thanks Dnej.

Thought about it but really want the winch rope disconnected from boat before I push boat into water.....

Regards
Splash

[Chimo]

Hi Splash

See pic. Sorry for the delay.

The large loop goes over the bollard on the fordeck, hook the whole thing on to the towbar to the left of the tow ball so you are clear of the winch.

Hold the coil of line and feed the boat off the trailer with the winch line and safety chain released. This is easy as the "8" setup makes it easy to hold tonnes of boat even with you teeth; if you need two hands to release the safety chain release the winch and maybe scratch your crot8h at the same time.::)

Cheers
Chimo

[Splash]

Thanks Chimo.

If I wanted to buy that "8" setup, what do i ask for in the shop?

Also, connecting the whole thing to the towbar will be at at very accute angle and probably not even stay on the tow bar (if loop is attached to bollard on foredeck)..

What am I missing here (when u say towbar - are you implying plate with hole next to towbar (towbar assy?) on vehicle )?


SPlash

[Chimo]

Thanks Chimo.

If I wanted to buy that "8" setup, what do i ask for in the shop?

Also, connecting the whole thing to the towbar will be at at very accute angle and probably not even stay on the tow bar (if loop is attached to bollard on foredeck)..

What am I missing here (when u say towbar - are you implying plate with hole next to towbar (towbar assy?) on vehicle )?


SPlash
Hi again

Q Where to buy and what to ask for
A See if you can find an absailing adventure mob who take people out swinging off cliffs etc. If they drop one of the "8"s they shouldn't use them again to hang of buildings or cliffs due o a possible risk of killing someone if it fractures. As a result you can often pick them up for nothing fom these people esp if you tell them what you are planning to use it for. Failing that sports stores who sell climbing stuff sell them. Grab a clip or two as well, good to use to put the package together I found. Also note the use of bowlines as the knot of preference.

Q Connecting

A Not sure what your towbar set is like but on the Hayman Reese on the Patrol theres a box tube section running from one side to the other with the pull and tongue in the middle. I use a chain around the box tube on the left / port / near side and then another length of line to the end of "8" assembly which ends up being to the side of the winch but out of the way of it.

Then the loop that runs out of the "8" I either pass over the bow roller or just over the bow to the bow bollard. Yes its an accute angle but its not an issue as you take off the safety chain while the winch cable is still connected to the boat and then hold the "8" line while you unwind the winch so the winch line is slack and the "8" line takes the load then you unclip the winch cable and use the "8" and its looped line to lower the boat off the trailer. Remember that since I paid heaps to get my 4 wheel electric over hydraulic breakaway brakes rebuilt I have not drowned my brakes and only wet the last few rollers on the Tinka trailer. Its been a lot less exciting dragging the boat thru Surfers Paradise to the boat ramp (when I do that these days) since the brakes got fixed.

Hope that makes it easier to understand. I may have not been clear enough with this "8" set up but using it certainly takes the excitement out of launching on even the steepest ramps which is exactly the way I like it.

Cheers
Chimo

[Splash]

Thanks Chimo.

I will follow up when I am in Darwin.

SPlahs

[Splash]

hey mate have done the same thing you are able to get a quick release clip is like a shackle but has short string you pull and releases they are about 60 dollars but they work a treat


ANy link for this one?

[lee8sec]

I just use a bow rope,, tie that to me winch post, un wind about a foot of winch strap till the rope takes up the weight of the boat.

Then when ready pull the slip not from me bow rope. It saves swimming after the boat too, just about p!ss meself when I see blokes swim after there boat.

X2. Safe & easy. Leigh

[Mindi]

Hi Splash

See pic. Sorry for the delay.

The large loop goes over the bollard on the fordeck, hook the whole thing on to the towbar to the left of the tow ball so you are clear of the winch.

Hold the coil of line and feed the boat off the trailer with the winch line and safety chain released. This is easy as the "8" setup makes it easy to hold tonnes of boat even with you teeth; if you need two hands to release the safety chain release the winch and maybe scratch your crot8h at the same time.::)

Cheers
Chimo

This is a great idea thanks...I usually use a couple of turns of the painter around the winch post to take the weight of the boat then flip it off but on a steep ramp where you might want to control the launch a bit more this is really good...thanks

[Splash]

hey mate have done the same thing you are able to get a quick release clip is like a shackle but has short string you pull and releases they are about 60 dollars but they work a treat

I need help gettign this clip - anyone provide part name and where I can get it from?

Splash

[trueblue]

PM me your contact details...

I have a spare one

Cheers

[Splash]

DOne ................

[trueblue]

This is what they look like

[Chimo]

Splash

Heres a strong(er) one too.

Hope no ones behind the boat when you pull the pin and its in deep enough water!

http://www.whitworths.com.au/main_itemdetail.asp?cat=200&item=79566&intAbsolutePage=1

Cheers
Chimo

[Splash]

Thansk Chimo

[Splash]

I've had the same problem (if I read you right) since I upgraded the trailer. Boat wants to get off as soon as it feels the slope of the ramp.

This has worked well for me for the past 2 years or so (similar to roughasguts, but no knots).

A couple of turns with the bow rope around the winch post on the trailer. Release the ratchet on the winch. Hold firm to the bow rope until the boat has rolled back enough to take up the slack. Remove the (now slack) winch rope from the eye bolt on the boat. Flip the bow rope turns off the trailer winch post. Away she goes while you let the bow rope loosely run out through your hands.

Is that the same problem?

See ya,
RJ

The trouble I still have is that there is no slack at all from the winch rope - under any circumstance. How can I induce slack into my winch rope so that I can disconnect it from the boat - before it runs down into the water?

Splash

[RJ5023]

Splash,

I have a manual winch, and with the rachet released the winch cable is very free and I can give it a bit of a shove or pull to create slack between the boat and the winch once the bow rope has taken up the weight of the boat.

I'm guessing that you've either got an electric winch, or your manual winch drum is too stiff to turn freely and maybe needs a bit of attention? I think you should be able to pull the cable off the winch drum very easily once the rachet is released.

RJ

[TimiBoy]

hey mate have done the same thing you are able to get a quick release clip is like a shackle but has short string you pull and releases they are about 60 dollars but they work a treat

If you go to a Bolt Place you'll get the quick release shackle for around $20. Anything you buy at the Chandlery is a third of the price at Bolt Place. I use two of these shackles on the 685 and they are a Godsend.

Cheers,

Tim

[Splash]

thanks guys.

TIMIBOY - pic of your quick release setup?

RJ - I have a manual winch and maybe the drum is a bit stiff - I'll lube it up.

SPlash

[TimiBoy]

I disconnect the shackles when the boat's ready to move off the trailer. Then loosen off the winch a bit, and undo. Motor pulls her off, or a quick reverse and stop from the car.

A shackle would work for you on the end of your winch cable, maybe?

Cheers,

Tim

[pontificator]

figure 8s brings to mind crossed krabs.

Which for this purpose could easily be dodgied up with shackles, if dropped/condemned 8s can't be obtained.

I use the wrap around the winch post method myself

[trueblue]

If you go to a Bolt Place you'll get the quick release shackle for around $20. Anything you buy at the Chandlery is a third of the price at Bolt Place. I use two of these shackles on the 685 and they are a Godsend.

Cheers,

Tim

quite true, bolt places etc have the cheaper ones, however these are 'usually' commodity grade, which is of a lesser quality.

Just check on the quality - doesn't always happen, but you can be ripped off.

And in some cases for your purpose commodity grade is just fine.

A decision you have to make.

cheers

Mick

[Chimo]

Splash,

Dont know about you but I like the idea of being able to control the boat all the way down the ramp so in my case where I limit trailer drowning to the minimum so "the release and let her roll method" is just too "exciting" for me.::)

Chimo

[trueblue]

The boat should not be just rolled downwards without any control. This is hazardous.

If you are going to use a release type shackle, first thing you should do it winch the boat off the winch post stop by at least 6 inches. Then you should get into the boat and start the engine and put it into gear and move forward a bit which holds it up on the trailer and releases tension on the winch wire while you release the quick release clip. (you can tie a cord from the release ring and throw that up onto the bow of the boat to avoid having to lean off the bow to pull the release) Then take the boat out of gear and let it roll down the trailer while you are in it, and in total control with the engine running.

The only advantage of the release clip in this situation, is that you are in the boat with the winch still connected, and you don't have to get out of the boat to release the winch cable.

cheers

Mick

[Malcolm W]

If you go to a Bolt Place you'll get the quick release shackle for around $20. Anything you buy at the Chandlery is a third of the price at Bolt Place. I use two of these shackles on the 685 and they are a Godsend.

Cheers,

Tim Went to my local bolt shop and got the marine grade 2000 kg one for $27.50. Works great, I just have to make sure no one is behind as my boat rolls off pretty quick. I used to use the bow rope trick. The quick release shackle is brilliant for beach launching also. Thanks for the tip.