blackjack
23-06-2008, 12:12 PM
Chimo asked me a couple of questions and I've put a bit of thought into the replies. Just thought they might be a timely reminder to post them under a heading to highlight them, tho i am not an expert and indeed welcome anyone else's opinions/corrections.
Blackjenny
ps got too much time on my hands - been sick in bed with laptop :book2:
i'll STFUP now ;D promise...
from 'trailer weight, towing advice':
Originally Posted by Chimo http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?p=846653#post846653)
Hi Jen
Another question for you and Jack. (Maybe we need a Granny's Cures and how and why they work thread too).
Why when you are spiked by a flathead can you cure the pain by inserting the spiked finger into the stomach juices of the offendinge flathead or its cousin for that matter?
Cheers
Chimo
blackjenny on deck
no expert on this at all chimo, but my best answer is because of the alkaline nature of the stomach slime proteins (edited, had it round the wrong way before) 'denaturing' the acid components of the spike poison literally changing their nature and rendering them to a new makeup. an actual chemical reaction takes place between the protein and the acid. the basis of hot water treatment (treatment of choice) is similar. the heat denatures the acid protein of the poison, is heat labile. but you don't usually have hot water to hand. :'( (even fresh body temp urine may help if nothing else available - it's sterile too)
from what i have gathered since i first posted this answer:
the spike poison is acidic, maybe pH 4.0
the belly slime is more alkaline, maybe around pH 7.0-8.0
(saltwater also is pH around 8.0)
acid + alkali = neutral
interesting also slime contains enzymes and has antibacterial properties that help protect the skin of the fish
if the injury is penetrating in any real depth, you'd need to try and get the acids and the alkalis to contact each other too i'd imagine. maybe the salty slime water can penetrate. at least you've got the fish at hand, so to speak, so the first aid is there ready to try
http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index...260.xml&coll=1 (http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-35/1202019674247260.xml&coll=1) - an interesting link about medical properties of fish slime
i can never forget being with my darling Daddy one day when i was about 7 years old. he was spiked by something when he was digging around in the contents of seaweed from a hand prawning net in Lake Macquarie, NSW
it was called a bull rout
anyway, my dad was a tough guy and to see the pain he suffered was just awful. he wanted mum to cut his arm off!
this is a really useful page of first aid for the outdoors, simple and practical advice
http://www.parasolemt.com.au/venum.asp (http://www.parasolemt.com.au/venum.asp)
maybe i'll print it off and laminate it for the boat? anyway guys, (and I mean gals too whenever I say that) i cannot stress enough just how CRITICAL it is to get some antiseptic cream, lotion or even basic soap and water wash on ANY cut big or small, that breaks through the integrity of your skin, especially if it draws blood. and i am as serious as death about what can happen if you don't. http://www.ausfish.com.au/yabbfiles/Smilies/bomb.gif (from secondary infection) make sure your tetanus cover is up-to-date too, c'mon guys MAN TF UP
also, there is a range of waterless handwashes available now in plastic pump packs, like Aquim, which you can put in your boat and have readily accessible. use it anytime you need to wash your hands
stay healthy, jenny
Blackjenny
ps got too much time on my hands - been sick in bed with laptop :book2:
i'll STFUP now ;D promise...
from 'trailer weight, towing advice':
Originally Posted by Chimo http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?p=846653#post846653)
Hi Jen
Another question for you and Jack. (Maybe we need a Granny's Cures and how and why they work thread too).
Why when you are spiked by a flathead can you cure the pain by inserting the spiked finger into the stomach juices of the offendinge flathead or its cousin for that matter?
Cheers
Chimo
blackjenny on deck
no expert on this at all chimo, but my best answer is because of the alkaline nature of the stomach slime proteins (edited, had it round the wrong way before) 'denaturing' the acid components of the spike poison literally changing their nature and rendering them to a new makeup. an actual chemical reaction takes place between the protein and the acid. the basis of hot water treatment (treatment of choice) is similar. the heat denatures the acid protein of the poison, is heat labile. but you don't usually have hot water to hand. :'( (even fresh body temp urine may help if nothing else available - it's sterile too)
from what i have gathered since i first posted this answer:
the spike poison is acidic, maybe pH 4.0
the belly slime is more alkaline, maybe around pH 7.0-8.0
(saltwater also is pH around 8.0)
acid + alkali = neutral
interesting also slime contains enzymes and has antibacterial properties that help protect the skin of the fish
if the injury is penetrating in any real depth, you'd need to try and get the acids and the alkalis to contact each other too i'd imagine. maybe the salty slime water can penetrate. at least you've got the fish at hand, so to speak, so the first aid is there ready to try
http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index...260.xml&coll=1 (http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-35/1202019674247260.xml&coll=1) - an interesting link about medical properties of fish slime
i can never forget being with my darling Daddy one day when i was about 7 years old. he was spiked by something when he was digging around in the contents of seaweed from a hand prawning net in Lake Macquarie, NSW
it was called a bull rout
anyway, my dad was a tough guy and to see the pain he suffered was just awful. he wanted mum to cut his arm off!
this is a really useful page of first aid for the outdoors, simple and practical advice
http://www.parasolemt.com.au/venum.asp (http://www.parasolemt.com.au/venum.asp)
maybe i'll print it off and laminate it for the boat? anyway guys, (and I mean gals too whenever I say that) i cannot stress enough just how CRITICAL it is to get some antiseptic cream, lotion or even basic soap and water wash on ANY cut big or small, that breaks through the integrity of your skin, especially if it draws blood. and i am as serious as death about what can happen if you don't. http://www.ausfish.com.au/yabbfiles/Smilies/bomb.gif (from secondary infection) make sure your tetanus cover is up-to-date too, c'mon guys MAN TF UP
also, there is a range of waterless handwashes available now in plastic pump packs, like Aquim, which you can put in your boat and have readily accessible. use it anytime you need to wash your hands
stay healthy, jenny