Fishing Not The Main Issue In MBMP Review

[Derek Bullock]

LOOKS LIKE IT IS A DONE DEAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation
The Honourable Andrew McNamara

14/03/2008

Strong Support for Increased Moreton Bay Protection


Public feedback on the draft re-zoning plan for Moreton Bay Marine Park has shown overwhelming support for increased protection for the internationally-renowned waterway.

Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation, Andrew McNamara, said today that the vast majority of public submissions call for greater protection than the 15 percent proposed under the draft plan released in December.

"South-east Queenslanders have demonstrated just how important Moreton Bay Marine Park is to them, with about 8,000 submissions received on the draft zoning plan," Mr McNamara said.

"This level of response is enormous, and indicates the growing awareness of the truly unique marine environment we have on our doorstep in Brisbane.

"Two-thirds of the submissions, or about 6,000, support at least 15 percent protection.

"Of that number, more than 4,500 submissions call for at least 30 percent to be preserved in green zones.

"It appears that most of those opposed to 30 or 15 percent protection have provided suggestions for alternative zoning so as to minimise the impacts on their personal use of the marine park.

"Anyone observing the consultation process through the media could be forgiven for thinking the review was all about fishing.

"It' about much more than fishing.

"It's about protecting the amenity, biodiversity and environmental value of this wondrous waterway for all users."

Mr McNamara said the submissions are now being analysed but we are already seeing overwhelming public support for increasing the level of protection for Moreton Bay Marine Park from its current miniscule level.

He said the Environmental Protection Agency will go through the process of assessing all submission against the independent scientific principles adopted at the beginning of this review process.

"All the major stakeholders provided submissions," Mr McNamara said.

"The draft zoning plan was developed with a focus on striking a balance between the conservation of the marine park and the needs of those who use it for recreation and business.

"I expect the submissions we've received will help us continue that focus as we work on developing the final plan.

"We have heard a wide range of views through the consultation period, from the 800 or so people who attended public information sessions, from the 40 or so meetings held with stakeholders, and from the thousands of emails, phone enquiries, letters and submissions."

Mr McNamara said all views will be considered in the development of the final zoning plan to be announced later this year.

Media contact: Peter McCarthy 3336 8004

[Didley]

########### :-/

[Jackinthebox]

" vast majority of public submissions call for greater protection than the 15 percent"


4500 out of 8000???? I don't think that looks like a vast majority to me?

It would have been interesting if there was a question in there that asked when was the last time you actually visited the Moreton Bay Marine Park? My guess is lots of people voting for greater protection pretty much have nothing to do with the bay, but want to "save the environment"

[fish-n-dive]

" My guess is lots of people voting for greater protection pretty much have nothing to do with the bay, but want to "save the environment"

I bet this statement is pretty spot on..........8-)

[Didley]

##################

[PinHead]

mainly a group of people that get their warm and fuzzies by thinking they are doing something for the environment by supporting this. They would be the same people that support the banning of plastic bags from supermarkets yet still buy their bread and veges and meat in plastic and coolite containers.
These green zones will do nothing to protect the environment..just keep the fishing people out..everything else remains the same...amazes me how stupid some of the general public can be.
You only have to look at the portfolio name to realise how hypocritical this all is.
Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation..Sustainablility..as they dredge the guts out of the bay for the runway..rip central qld out to get the coal not to mention all the other place. Climate Change...cannot think of anything he has done in that respect. Innovation..can only laugh at that title..nothing innovative about the govt. we have.

[BAT]

mainly a group of people that get their warm and fuzzies by thinking they are doing something for the environment by supporting this. They would be the same people that support the banning of plastic bags from supermarkets yet still buy their bread and veges and meat in plastic and coolite containers.
These green zones will do nothing to protect the environment..just keep the fishing people out..everything else remains the same...amazes me how stupid some of the general public can be.
You only have to look at the portfolio name to realise how hypocritical this all is.
Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation..Sustainablility..as they dredge the guts out of the bay for the runway..rip central qld out to get the coal not to mention all the other place. Climate Change...cannot think of anything he has done in that respect. Innovation..can only laugh at that title..nothing innovative about the govt. we have.

Your spot on with this PinHead! The thing is why does the high end of town that take our dough are no where to be seen on this? eg all the fishing boat builders,engines,bcf,ect,etc you know what I mean. The money we all spend compared to their support is 100 to 0.

Cheers BAT

[Tetsuo]

IMO the best way to protect an ecosystem is to let people use and appreciate it. Lets face it, if the next generation have no reason to head out on the water, why would they wish to see it kept healthy.

A healthy, diverse ecosystem is a fishermans first priority. We want the fish to be there!

[Dnepr_family]

This press release is probably the best example I've ever seen of the vile dishonesty within the Labor Party... yeah, harsh BUT TRUE!

The Minister releases a statement saying at least 4500 of the 8000 submissions endorse the 15% green zone plan - yet at the most recent rally he said, "Don't bother putting a response in if you just say you don't want green zones. We're interested in where you would propose putting the green zones, not whether you want them".

I LOVE manipulative words... and deceptive statistics. The Minister could have just as easily explained the statistics as I've created below, and it would be just as true as what he's claiming:

Minister: "I told the fisherman not to resist the green zones, just help us work out where to put them"

(That's 4500 of the 8000 accounted for)

Minister: "One thousand five hundred radical greenies demanded more than 15% protection, but we expected some people to do that."

(OK, we're up to 6000)

Minister: It looks like 2000 fishermen ignored my warning about resisting the green zones. We've already decided to put the green zones in so we're just going to ignore these 2000 radical - but we won't ignore the 1500 radical greenies.

(Ahhhh... all 8000 submissions accounted for.)

[max007]

"It appears that most of those opposed to 30 or 15 percent protection have provided suggestions for alternative zoning so as to minimise the impacts on their personal use of the marine park.

Correct me if I'm wrong but didnt the actual submission papers ask for alternatives to their proposal?

Is the Minister suggesting I am self centred and greedy cause I offered an alternative even though they requested alternative suggestions?. Thats the way have read his latest statement. I just love how politicians change things around too suit thier own agenda.

As for the numbers quoted in his press release I wonder how far they have been "stretched' in their favour. Are there any legal guys out there who could advise what would be involved to submit a Freedom of Information request to get a copy of all submissions to see the real picture.

[Luc]

All spin to support the green payback.

How can it not be about fishing as the main result of green zones is no fishing.

Green zones do not remedy the main problems for the bay being polution and habitat degradation from foreshore development & urban/industrial runoff.

As was said about the Bateman Bay MP, 'it appears that the main reasons for shutting down good fishing areas is that they're good fishing areas'.

Despite its faults, DPI&F does a better job managing fishing than the EPA does managing the environment.

Luc

[the gecko]

Spot on Luc. This deal was done a long time ago, and now its all about payback.

This whole process is about justifying decisions that theyve already made.

We should have been fighting politics with politics. As fisherman, weve been trying to show the process wasnt based on any scientific evidence. Maybe we should have been trying to show the people involved were corrupt and slept with prostitutes - that would have got some headlines.

Andrew

[Horse]

The biggest problem with with many of the green element is that the desire to "protect" areas that they have little or no actual knowledge of. Most of them will never have been in any of the areas to be designated Green and their only motivation behind their submissions is the warm fuzzy feeling the are getting from "saving all of the Turtlees, Dugongs and migratory birds" from the clutches of the neanderthal fishermen.

It is a sad fact that they are mostly two blind and isolated from reality to realize that most recreational fishos are very conscious of anything having a significant negative environmental impact on aquatic ecosystems as it will have a detrimental result on productivity levels and the long term viability and sustainability of our fishery.

Surely any decision making process should give more credence to stakeholders who actually use and enjoy the areas rather than those green groups whose greatest satisfaction come from a conceptual image of how the world should be.

The Ministers comments just verify my concerns from day one when it became obvious that the proposed zoning was a political payback to the Greens for jumping into bed with Labor. They will spin the data to justify the deals that have already been made.

We must however keep the pressure on and continue to fight the process as without a coordinated resistance the slide will accelerate and we will lose more and more of our rights to access marine park regions

Neil

[Chris Ryan]

I saw this yesterday when it hit my inbox.

FFFAARRRRRRKKKKKK

Sorry peoples. Step one didn't work as well as I expected.

[Blueroo]

So the bay continues to get polluted and raped by environmental vandals like the people building the new airport from material stripped from the bay but the EPA will swoop in and save the bay by stopping people fishing.
Yeah right, pull the other one.
I'd say the greenies are on the wrong side.

Stue

[Horse]

I saw this yesterday when it hit my inbox.

FFFAARRRRRRKKKKKK

Sorry peoples. Step one didn't work as well as I expected.

Chris.
Unfortunatly the Courier Mail and a few other media outlets are reluctant to let the facts stand in the way of a political agenda and we have been fighting a lopsided battle. Just imagine what would have happened without the SOBA resistance movement putting the issue to rec fishos. If a few thousand anti green zone submissions had not been generated then the greens would have had a complete mandate to push their 50% closure target.

As it is the proposals will probably go ahead but it could have easily been a much more negative income with aditional closures and a dangerous trend being put in place forthe next management plan review

Keep up the good fight

Neil

[Chris Ryan]

Thanks Neil. There are some on here that think I have an underlying political agenda rather than the cause at my heart. I dunno about the rest of you blokes but I thought if Party A was closing something off, you would go to Party B for assistance to keep it open. Seems I should be talking with Party A and say pretty please keep it open.

Anyway on another point, just looked at an email from the AMCS that was sent to me via a mate. I thought I had seen the 8000 number somewhere.......and I had. Straight from the AMCS email. This is a direct quote from their shark finning email (attached)

"We had overwhelming support, with over 8000 people signing a submission or petition. Please stay tuned to www.savemoretonbay.org.au (http://www.savemoretonbay.org.au/) as the campaign progresses."

So we see that the AMCS announced 8000 people signing THEIR submission, and Minister McNamara saying they had about 8000 public submissions in total.So where the bloody hell are all of ours????????

[CHAPPY]

My Grandad Once Said, When It Comes To Government, The Only Difference Between Communism And Democracy Is The Spelling.

The Minister Has Just Convinced Me That Grandad Was Right.

>:( Chappy

[Ben D]

The biggest problem with with many of the green element is that the desire to "protect" areas that they have little or no actual knowledge of. Most of them will never have been in any of the areas to be designated Green and their only motivation behind their submissions is the warm fuzzy feeling the are getting from "saving all of the Turtlees, Dugongs and migratory birds" from the clutches of the neanderthal fishermen.



In my experiences with these environmental types, this is exactly true. They are almost all completely ignorant of marine processes, and seem to lump recreational fishing in with commercial fishing practices.

[Black_Rat]

Written by Queensland Government Press Release Monday, 17 March 2008

Public feedback on the draft re-zoning plan for Moreton Bay Marine Park has shown overwhelming support for increased protection for the internationally-renowned waterway.

Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation, Andrew McNamara, said last week that the vast majority of public submissions call for greater protection than the 15 percent proposed under the draft plan released in December.




South-east Queenslanders have demonstrated just how important Moreton Bay Marine Park is to them, with about 8,000 submissions received on the draft zoning plan," Mr McNamara said.
"This level of response is enormous, and indicates the growing awareness of the truly unique marine environment we have on our doorstep in Brisbane.

"Two-thirds of the submissions, or about 6,000, support at least 15 percent protection.

"Of that number, more than 4,500 submissions call for at least 30 percent to be preserved in green zones.

"It appears that most of those opposed to 30 or 15 percent protection have provided suggestions for alternative zoning so as to minimise the impacts on their personal use of the marine park.



"Anyone observing the consultation process through the media could be forgiven for thinking the review was all about fishing.

"It' about much more than fishing.

"It's about protecting the amenity, biodiversity and environmental value of this wondrous waterway for all users."

Mr McNamara said the submissions are now being analysed but we are already seeing overwhelming public support for increasing the level of protection for Moreton Bay Marine Park from its current miniscule level.

He said the Environmental Protection Agency will go through the process of assessing all submission against the independent scientific principles adopted at the beginning of this review process.

"All the major stakeholders provided submissions," Mr McNamara said.

"The draft zoning plan was developed with a focus on striking a balance between the conservation of the marine park and the needs of those who use it for recreation and business.

"I expect the submissions we've received will help us continue that focus as we work on developing the final plan.

"We have heard a wide range of views through the consultation period, from the 800 or so people who attended public information sessions, from the 40 or so meetings held with stakeholders, and from the thousands of emails, phone enquiries, letters and submissions."

Mr McNamara said all views will be considered in the development of the final zoning plan to be announced later this year.

[4x4frog]

If, through some part of the Freedom of Information act we got hold of all the submissions would the truth really be shown to be what they are claiming in the weight of submissions asking for more protection? I doubt that there are that many average people out there willing to spend the time to go through a submission that didn't directly affect them. How many members does the Green party have and if we checked the names and addresses of the respondents how many would correlate? Yes, I know it is the same as we fishos responding for our cause, but at least we have read all the information available to us where I would bet the green party people just take the bits they feel comfortable with>:(
I wonder how different Jo average's view would be if he knew how much pollution and damage the EPA will allow the developers to reak on the Bay?

[Local_Guy]

it's the g'ment. the green zones were going to come in whether you submitted your feedback or not. They just have to get feedback from the fishing persons side so everything is legal and you can't turn around and say "they didn't give me a voice"...

What is not mentioned in the press release is the numbers of fishing people who submitted applications. This number could be 15,000 as far as we know, but he is only mentioning one side of the story.

Oh and if even 1/2 of those submissions for % of green zones were done by peteition... seriously, people sign these things without even knowing what they are actually signing for..

[Scott nthQld]

If the MPMA is "about much more than fishing" then why is it that fishing is the only industry that will suffer from this 'protection'.

Sorry if this was brought up before, but arguing over numbers would be the last thing on my mind right now, the QLD State Govt has openly communicated that the protection is not targeted at fishing, then why do they want to stop it?

Chris, (sorry again if you already picked it up) but wouldn't it be an easier battle if this argument was brought before the MP's? Why ban fishing if protecting Moreton Bay isn't about a multi-million dollar industry (both pro and rec)?

[pickers]

the only honest polly is a dead one , the battle lines were drawn and the winner decided long before any of this became public knoledge.
once labor won the election it just gave the greens,epa the go ahead to do what they like , polly's will use all the cloak and dagger tactics just to get your votes and once they have it they use it to screw you over.
whats that I hear.....pickers is having a polly bash...I WISH..
pickers

ps..we can thank those who voted for labor.

[CHAPPY]

Maybe creating more green zones means less people on the bay to see the polution created by urban development and the desalination plant thus less flack to Captain Bligh and our open government.

Chappy

[hodges4]

You want to see a minister of the crown do something in your favour. Make it very, very clear to him that he will be targeted in the next election with a very heavy campaign to unseat him. You don't need a new candidate either. Just pick his closest rival and heavily support him
There's nothing more important to a politician than re-election.
We just gotta get as organised as the greens.

[Poodroo]

Unfortunately the only way to beat politicians in the political arena is to become a politician. As already stated our battle has been very lopsided. We were never going to stop the green zones. We need more man power and support than what we have been getting to have any chance of persuading them to think again about green zones in Moreton Bay. This is only the beginning.

Poodroo

[hodges4]

I've got to disagree with the comment on only way to beat a politician is to become one. You only have to threaten one with the sack to get a reaction. Below is the results of the last State Election for the seat of Hervey Bay. As you can see the Minister for Sustainability, Climate Change and Innovation didn't romp in. After distribution of preferences he obtained only 51.79% of the vote. He relied on Greens preferences which he now has to repay.
What I am saying is to make it blatently clear to him, before the decision on Moreton Bay is made, that a campaign to unseat him will be carried out at the next election.
If you try to become a politician you have to get over 50% of the vote. To unseat this one only needs a thousand or so out of 30,000 in Hervey Bay to change their vote. The Greens only got 8% and can control the government on these issues.

There's plenty of fishermen up there and they vote.

McNAMARA, Andrew (http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/Hervey%20Bay/candidate1.html)http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/results/sitting.gif http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/results/tick.gif ALP 11,438 41.40%
SCHUBACK, Peter (http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/Hervey%20Bay/candidate2.html)1,607 5.82%
ROHOZINSKI, Jan (http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/Hervey%20Bay/candidate3.html)NPA 10,198 36.91%
STEVENSON, Matt (http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/Hervey%20Bay/candidate4.html)GRN 1,913 6.92%
BENSON-STOTT, Elizabeth (http://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/elections/state/state2006/Hervey%20Bay/candidate5.html)FFP 2,472 8.95%

[Poodroo]

There's plenty of fishermen up there and they vote.



Well I agree there are a lot of fishermen out there and if we could all get them out to voice their opinions we would be on a winner for sure however we seem to be flogging a dead horse as the old saying goes. I was at both of the protest rallies and even though I think the result was great out of the people that did make an appearance I couldn't help but to feel disappointment that the people who did show up wouldn't even represent 1% of the fishing community. At the Brisbane River Rally in February we had roughly 60 boats on the water. If we had the support by at least 50% of the fishing population just how many boats could we have had? I would have seen at least triple the amount of boats heading out for a fish when I was marshalling at the designated ramp. Relying on people to make their voices heard is probably harder than becoming a politician. To all those who did make the effort once again I thank you. Can't show enough appreciation for your efforts.

Poodroo

[hodges4]

Poodroo
Problem is you were trying to influence the government in direct competition with the greens and they have the ability to change the government with preference deals. You were too small and not dangerous to the government.

If you were to put all your might into threatening to unseat the minister or 1 other influential politician then they'd be in trouble. Their individual political survival may become more important than the party line and you could even end up with a supporter.

Remember nothing is more important than being re-elected.

Forget the party politics and unseat them, they've forgotten you.

[PinHead]

trying to get a political force from fishermen..forget it..look at the crap that went on at the last election..too many egos on many inexperienced heads made them all look like a bunch of fools.

A powerfu llobby group would be ideal but that won't happen either..sad but true.

[hodges4]

Yeh, your right, but I can dream. Fishermen wishing to become a influencing force need a leader and there's nobody out there. There's a lot who think they are but fall short, unfortunately. The end result is we've just got to cop what we get. Maybe when some retired ex solicitors or queen's council on the Gold Coast gets upset, maybe then we'll get someone who the pollies will listen to. otherwise, I give up. It's here I should say I bend over and cop it, but I wont.

[bayfisher]

trying to get a political force from fishermen..forget it..look at the crap that went on at the last election..too many egos on many inexperienced heads made them all look like a bunch of fools.

A powerfu llobby group would be ideal but that won't happen either..sad but true.


Your absolutely right. Big lobby groups with power and money wield much more sway over government decisions then little political parties. Its hard to run a political party on one issue and be successful, If we look at the American system some of their lobby groups like the fishing and hunting groups wield some tremendous power.