Is CDMA To Remain on Air or Not?

[Chimo]

Hi All

Lifted from one of todays papers' so what is the go. Telstras pushing those of us who are hanging on the still reliable CDMA to change to Next g saying thae are going to close it down but according to the paper itsd not a done deal.

Anyone out there with any info?

If and I say If one has to go next G, what is the pick phone on the cheapest plan that gets coverage out to sea as well as bush coverage?

From the paper:-

"The Federal Government is waiting for an independent report, due on Monday, before deciding if Telstra can turn off its national CDMA phone network on January 28.

Telstra CDMA phones will stop working in less than four weeks -- with customers losing their personal mobile phone numbers by late February -- if new federal Communications Minister Stephen Conroy agrees to Telstra's shutdown plans.

A spokeswoman for Senator Conroy said the independent audit by the Australian Communications and Media Authority must find that the Next G mobile phone network gives the "same or better coverage" than the CDMA system before Telstra is permitted to switch off its CDMA network"

Cheers
Chimo::)

[deadbeatloser]

i will put money on it that it doesnt close down as they havnt got the same coverage on next g yet which will be the end of cdma when coverage is equal or greater on the new service. i think if you search threads you will find more info on this site
dbl;D

[plaztix]

I didn't think it still existed. They've been talking about closing it down for years. I guess like DBL said, until they get alternative networks to replace it in all areas then they will be shooting themselves in the foot if they close it down.

[Local_Guy]

once again telstra proves themselves by ending a service so all the people out there on CDMA have to go buy a new plan and buy a new phone..

not good for the consumer, but good for business. But why is it that none of the other companies upgrade thier coverage, or is it that they just aren't "telstra".

[FNQCairns]

What simply astounds me is that they were allowed to turn the signal strength of CDMA down to give justification for those connected to switch plans as their once capable CDMA phone was now for some reason degrading in signal strength.

With the liberals out the new government has the job of reading the regulations passed before their time without any of the 'old boys' and special 'off the record' considerations being foremost in the end result as deemed by the department.

Anyway with a bit of luck this time we should see some honesty to wards us and not simply what is good for telstra and politics while pretending the people are still being looked after.

I give it 2 years then we are back to square 1.

Think it will stay on unless the campaign by Telstra and the former Minister (with deliberately blind eyes) to defraud and force people from the CDMA network actually worked as they had planed.

cheers fnq

[Steve B]

In the large statewide goverment dept where I work, we have just changed ALL phones in QLD to next G (at least 3000 phones I reckon). Coverage ATM is relatively the same as the old CDMA, particulary here in Gin Gin which its pretty ordinary around the ridges.

When we quized the tech guru powers that be they informed us:
Currently the Ntxt G and CDMA beams are sharing all the towers and frequencies. When they switch CDMA off, the towers will have less competing frequencies and the Next G will have less resistance and hence further coverage. Something along those lines (pardon he pun) If that makes sense to anyone. Aparrently, they did a test out west with Next G at Winton and got reception at Kynuna (approx200km up road from 1 tower).

Nutshell, When they switch off CDMA (or if they do-as per previous posts) the Next G coverage should improve. So we were led to believe.

[FNQCairns]

In the large statewide goverment dept where I work, we have just changed ALL phones in QLD to next G (at least 300 phones I reckon). Coverage ATM is relatively the same as the old CDMA, particulary here in Gin Gin which its pretty ordinary around the ridges.

When we quized the tech guru powers that be they informed us:
Currently the Ntxt G and CDMA beams are sharing all the towers and frequencies. When they switch CDMA off, the towers will have less competing frequencies and the Next G will have less resistance and hence further coverage. Something along those lines (pardon he pun) If that makes sense to anyone. Aparrently, they did a test out west with Next G at Winton and got reception at Kynuna (approx200km up road from 1 tower).

Nutshell, When they switch off CDMA (or if they do-as per previous posts) the Next G coverage should improve. So we were led to believe.

I think you are right, NG will be as good as the old CDMA was or could be now with basic upgrades it would have recieved by now and before they turned it down to accomodate NG on the same tower, near some position and frequency, up here CDMA over the last 1.5y or so is now a mere shadow of it former self (only a bit better than GSM now), that's gotta be fraud but wait:)..... is a government in law even capable of that definition!!

Telstra and the former Gov were not silly they know which towers to turn down and not cause an resounding uproar from the 'Bush services' advocates, just yelling is ok cause nobody in wider society cares unless the media runs with it for a month to make them feel guilty enough.

jeese I am jaded, it's fun watching how well this country has been managed:o

cheers fnq

cheers fnq

[Chimo]

So if we have to change over to NG from CDMA do we choose one of the "country" phones to get the best off shore and bush coverage and if so which one is the pick of them?

I understand what you say FNQ and others; but how and why is it that the govt is so useless when it comes to assessing signal strength if T can spike the playing field and no one is any the wiser?

It stinks, to say the least.

Chimo
Very GOM.

[FNQCairns]

So if we have to change over to NG from CDMA do we choose one of the "country" phones to get the best off shore and bush coverage and if so which one is the pick of them?

I understand what you say FNQ and others; but how and why is it that the govt is so useless when it comes to assessing signal strength if T can spike the playing field and no one is any the wiser?

It stinks, to say the least.

Chimo
Very GOM.

They know all about it, the political process, backroom deals, corruption and promises that come to fruit after ministers are out of politics take precedent, besides who is someone? anyone? going to call... ghostbusters! our federal government was/is? a law unto themselves, nothing that doesn't solidly make the media gets past their firewall to be taken seriously, who bothers these days.

cheers fnq

[Chimo]

Steve B

What breed of next G did your Dept purchase?

Are any of your people marine based or is the dept rural or regional centre or city centred?

thanks

Cheers
Chimo

[SatNav]

1. Jan 28 is the planned shutdown date and all indications and current urgency indicates there will be shutdown.

2. Normal voice users intending to migrate their existing CDMA number to NextG must do this on or before Jan 25 as Jan 28 is a public holiday in Victoria and migrations are only processed Monday to Friday 9am to 3pm

3. After Jan 28 old CDMA number will not be able to be migrated to NextG

4. Somehow the thought that CDMA will extend beyond Jan 28 is extremely low and I suspect any bet you made on CDMA going beyond Jan 28 would be an extreme long shot.

5. Yes not all NextG phones are the same or receive the same, some are extremely bad.

6. Ensure any new phone purchased is NextG and not a 3G only.

[Chimo]

Hi Guys

Update re CDMA Next G:'(

I spent several hours with some of the staff of the old country wide business section and determined that as many of us believe it will be shut down:(

Also found out that if you havn't changed over you will probably find your number is embargoed for a while and you probably won't lose it if you get another phone reasonably soon.:P

I found with my CDMA that my reception even around the GC was getting worse :'( and places where I used to have signal I didn't any more. Whether this is due to Telsra fiddling or as they suggest the old phones don't discriminate well enough to sort out the signals that they don't get a signal at all blh blah etc ..who knows ...>:( .

The upshot was that in my case I got sick of it and went out and bought a Next G phone. Sat Nav is spot on that there are big differences and the only ones to even look at if you want to be able to get out bush and also hopefully get a signal at sea is the better blue tick country phones.

The telsta people here were much more helpful than I ever could have hoped for :o to the extent that they offered to lend me a phone :o :o to try out (with me to pay for the calls but that was fair enought I thought.) I was all set to do it when they mentioned that they had previously lent one to a boatie who did the trip GC to the Whitsundays and back running a loaner next G and also his own CDMA.

I was told the NextG was claimed to do the job on that trip so I thought to hell with it I not into reinventing the wheel so forget the loaner.

Next thing thing was which phone.

I ended up with the F165 as you can stick a 9Dba antenna on it and also charge it off a computer too etc and you can read the screen and the keys are big enough to use plus it seems to work and I get signal now where I wasn't getting it with the old CDMA.

Given the way the CDMA signal / performance has got worse it looks like they've got us and there is only so long you can fight . :-[

At least waiting this long there are a few OK phones to buy or get free on the plans and get $100 off the bill plus the other choice bits according to what plan you get. Those who bought rubbish Next G are getting free replacements so they will get fringe service or at least thats the case in TAS I believe. Should be the same everywhere surely!

Thanks for all the advice and messages re this. Together with some puter research and the surprising helpful Telstra people both in the business area and the commercial outlet I can now move on to the next item.........;)

Cheers
Chimo


PS anyone interested in a good working CDMA with two batteries etc? All you need is to find somewhere with ongoing CDMA signal coverage to use the b...... thing.

[Bonus]

SatNav is on the ball. The CDMA service will most likely finish on 28.1.08. I have bought a Telstra F165 and it works well on Moreton Island which is my fringe area.

[Tony_P]

I actually work for telstra in a call centre and as far as I know the CDMA network will be shutdown as of the 28.01.08. The real decision will be made by the minister for communications on the 21.01.08. He will decide whether or not the NEXT G network is as good as or better than the CDMA network and give Telstra the go ahead to shutdown the CDMA Network. I really can't see much stopping it as Telstra conducted there own study last year and achieved equivalancy to the CDMA network back in October last year.

[Steve B]

Chimo, I'm with the QAS. We got the Telstra ZTE something* I beleive (i havent got one with me) they look like a brick. They are spose to be the toughest phone telstra put out. We have had several phones in this region alone randomly turning themselves off for no reason. Not good. The powers that be have taken this up with telstra, I am unsure of the result yet.

Question: I have the Nokia 6120 which is 3G ....Will it be switched off (if I read previous post right) I thought it was same as Next G.

My wife has a digital (or the original signal, whatever that was). Its not CDMA. Will it still work after the changover??

* I will check the phone tommorrow to see what the exact model is. I am pretty sure thats it.

thanks for any help

steve

[Chimo]

Chimo, I'm with the QAS. We got the Telstra ZTE something* I beleive (i havent got one with me) they look like a brick. They are spose to be the toughest phone telstra put out. We have had several phones in this region alone randomly turning themselves off for no reason. Not good. The powers that be have taken this up with telstra, I am unsure of the result yet.

Question: I have the Nokia 6120 which is 3G ....Will it be switched off (if I read previous post right) I thought it was same as Next G.

My wife has a digital (or the original signal, whatever that was). Its not CDMA. Will it still work after the changover??

* I will check the phone tommorrow to see what the exact model is. I am pretty sure thats it.

thanks for any help

steve

Hi Steve

I think we have the same phone. Not quite a brick but not as small as some.
ZTE Telstra F165 Durable HSDPA 3G Mobile Phone is the full description. Telstra people reckon its the best phone in the NextG range for country area reception.

Please post the results of the auto turn off thing in this thread when you find out.

3G is not going to be turned off only CDMA is what they are proposing to turn off if they get the OK.

Your wifes phone shouldn't be affected either.

Cheers
Chimo
PS I'm not claiming to be a phone expert, I'm sure there are others more qualified who can comment .

[Steve B]

Chimo,

Thats the phone. They are bigger than most, that right. Thanks for that info.

Whats the difference between 3g and nextg?

steve

[Chimo]

Chimo,

Thats the phone. They are bigger than most, that right. Thanks for that info.

Whats the difference between 3g and nextg?

steve

Steve

They did tell me but I dont know enough to be able to explain other than to say that Next G is supposed to be like a "Burger with lot" and 3G is just a Cheese Burger but I'll leave it for one of our "tech heads" to explain it in technical terms.

While your waiting for that answer read this from a Tas paper today

Cheers
Chimo

Telstra all at sea


Article from: http://www.news.com.au/images/sources/h14_themercury.gif</IMG> (http://www.news.com.au/mercury/)

SUE NEALES
January 16, 2008 12:00am

IT has often been said that Telstra moves in mysterious ways.
Still, who would expect to see a Telstra technician on a jetski juggling three mobile phones in the dangerous seas off the Tasman Peninsula?

But that was the scene yesterday after Telstra urgently dispatched one of its technical experts from Dunalley on a jetski -- minus Telstra signage -- to discover why Snug pensioner Len Pullen had been unable to get Next G cover while fishing last week off Little Bay.

As the Mercury revealed yesterday, Mr Pullen's arm artery was punctured by a spiked dogfish shark in a freak accident last week only 500m from shore near Cape Frederick Hendrick.

With blood spurting everywhere and only a few minutes to live, Mr Pullen was angry that his state-of-the-art Next G Telstra mobile phone did not work in a fishing spot where he said he had had no problems calling out with his old CDMA Telstra phone in the past.

Telstra plans to switch off its CDMA mobile phone network nationwide in less than two weeks, leaving only its more modern Next G service.

The Federal Government will announce next Monday whether the CDMA network, used for coverage in rural and regional Australia, will be allowed to become defunct on January 28, as Telstra hopes.

The Government can stop or delay the turning-off of the CDMA network until it is convinced coverage problems in places such as Tasmania and rural Queensland have been solved and the Next G network provides equal coverage.

Hence the eagerness of Telstra yesterday to send one of its technicians out on to the high seas to test if Mr Pullen's problems were real.

Last night, Telstra's Tasmanian general manager, Noel Hunt, said that his jetski-riding technician had gone to the exact spot where Mr Pullen's mishap had occurred and had been able to get Next G coverage with an "appropriate" Telstra "blue tick" mobile phone.

Blue tick Next G models work better than other phone handsets in regional areas where Next G signals are weak.

Mr Hunt said the Next G signal was so strong his technician had even been able to hold a video conference from his bobbing jetski. No CDMA coverage was available in the same spot, he said.

"It shows the Next G and CDMA networks are equivalent -- and Next G may even be better -- but you have got to have the right gear," Mr Hunt said last night.

[Steve B]

MMMMmmmmm cheesburger;D

that's good enough explanation for me thanks chimo.

cheers steve

[Tony_P]

Hi Steve,
The difference between 3G and Next G is the frequency or bandwtih in which the phone sends and recieves information.

3G runs on the 2100 Bandwith and has only been available in most capital cities and a few regional areas.

Next G runs on the 850 Bandwith and will be available everywhere CDMA is available. They basically upgraded the CDMA towers to Next G as they both run on a similar frequency. CDMA runs off a 900 Bandwith.

In terms of Bandwith, the lower the bandwith the greater distance you can be away from a base station and still recieve reception. Which is where the theory that Next G will have slightly better coverage than CDMA as it runs off the 850 Bandwith and CDMA on the 900 Bandwith.

But really there are not to many real differences between 3G and Next G, but unless you live in a capital city, I would be getting a next g phone.

Also Steve if your phone was the Nokia 6120, than that is a NEXT G phone.

Cheers Tony

[Chimo]

The latest as of 25 mins ago

I guess it means that if you bought a crap phone they are supposed to GIVE you a replacement that works:) At least the new F165 seems to work but time will tell.:-/

Govt postpones CDMA network closure

Posted 23 minutes ago
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200702/r127868_419012.jpg (http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200702/r127868_614059.jpg)Senator Conroy says the Next G network is not up to scratch due to existing problems with phone handsets. (Telstra)


The Federal Government has postponed the closure of Telstra's CDMA network planned for this month.
The telco was preparing to end the network in 10 days, swapping over to its newer Next G Network.
An audit of the Next G's performance compared with CDMA coverage has been carried out.
Federal Communications Minister Stephen Conroy says at present he is not in a position to declare the newer network is equivalent to the existing CDMA network.
Senator Conroy says the newer network is not up to scratch due to existing problems with phone handsets.
He says many customers are being given new phones that do not provide equal coverage.
"I have made it clear to Telstra that it should continue do everything possible to ensure that customers are using the correct Next G equipment," he said.
"This should include replacing handsets at no financial penalty."
Telstra has two weeks to advise the Government on how it plans to rectify the problems.


Chimo

[SatNav]

1. Political interference will not solve the poblem

2. Those that have been sold 3G only phones should definately be shown some mercy

3. Until CDMA is closed and NextG fully powered up then everybody is simply speculating on if the system is equiv or better

4. There is simply no way to determine if NextG is equiv or better until CDMA is closed and the power and antenna arrays are fully optimized

5. The debate over coverage being equiv or better is by ill informed and inexperienced people

[FNQCairns]

Just great this news- knew it, well I at least hope to see some truth in big business get forced upon them.

The corrupt former communications department didn't get its way, defies logic when the only public institution actively set's about to screw so many thousands over and the only place they have to turn was to the department actively fostering it in starry eyed adoration of telsta and duplicit with!

At least we got a decision from this new minister that was for the people, Telstra's partner in crime has rolled:) they may actually have to justify their claim now with hard evidence and not a wine and cheese night followed by a big political donatation right up Koonans clacker and a wink wink for the comfortable apolitical future.

Bet telstra cannot pull it together by the next deadline either, considering that is this time around it may need to now deal with at least most basic morality in government!!

Stick it right to them Mr new minister they have had it all their own way for too long.

cheers fnq

[SatNav]

1. All this is only delaying the invevitable

2. What is required in the decision making is rationality and not political interference based on the thinking this is some form of popularity contest

[Poseidon]

The dog is chasing its tail. As has been said already many times and by many who should know, the true strength of NextG won't be known until CDMA is shutdown.

To allow the deadline to pass is not helping the situation. People have had more than enough notice, more than enough offers (many free) to change-over.

Just get on with it.

[Rod Fishing]

Just great this news- knew it, well I at least hope to see some truth in big business get forced upon them.

The corrupt former communications department didn't get its way, defies logic when the only public institution actively set's about to screw so many thousands over and the only place they have to turn was to the department actively fostering it in starry eyed adoration of telsta and duplicit with!

At least we got a decision from this new minister that was for the people, Telstra's partner in crime has rolled:) they may actually have to justify their claim now with hard evidence and not a wine and cheese night followed by a big political donatation right up Koonans clacker and a wink wink for the comfortable apolitical future.

Bet telstra cannot pull it together by the next deadline either, considering that is this time around it may need to now deal with at least most basic morality in government!!

Stick it right to them Mr new minister they have had it all their own way for too long.

cheers fnq


I take it you didnt agree with Lberals policies, at leats when they had office the banks didnt raise interest rates without the reserve bank doing do first.

FNQCAIRNS you should be careful of what your saying because if one of said corrupt communications department reads this you have left yourself open to public litigation and could very well be sued for defimation of charactor.

Just a thought, dont want to offend you in any way but clearly by your post you dont really care who you offend.

Cheers Rod....8-)

[FNQCairns]

I take it you didnt agree with Lberals policies, at leats when they had office the banks didnt raise interest rates without the reserve bank doing do first.

FNQCAIRNS you should be careful of what your saying because if one of said corrupt communications department reads this you have left yourself open to public litigation and could very well be sued for defimation of charactor.

Just a thought, dont want to offend you in any way but clearly by your post you dont really care who you offend.

Cheers Rod....8-)

Hi Rod, simply not possible to offend me personally on a forum.

Yeah I agree, but no not a lib hater but I am a behaviour hater I attribute that to who-ever fit's the mould, the libs were and easy mark, it takes a very incompetent physicy to naturally ignore what they were capable of and exhibited often, with hope it will change but what I said earlier for how long- a couple of years??

I also agree, the politics of frighten into submission for personal gain is well used by some even unrelated in any way but in personality, but never without a inward looking self interested stance, gotta expect that today such is the dumbed down state of political arrangements.

cheers fnq

[finding_time]

;)
5. The debate over coverage being equiv or better is by ill informed and inexperienced people



Thank god your here Sat Nav to keep the ill informed and inexperienced people in there place!!::) ::) ::)

Im both ill informed and inexperienced but i do know this, atm my cdma works FAR FAR better than the next g phone beside me infact i was getting signal a further 15kms east of the point where my mates ( blue tick) next g phone lost coverage. Will i get coverage Sat Navwhen the Next g signal is boosted up? Telstra cant tell me this but maybe a highly experienced and informed person such as your self could enlighten this poor dimwit !!!

Ian

[mik01]

I worked for T for a few years, and remember well the exact same debate when the analogue network was shut down and cdma its replacement.

Its funny, but it really becomes such an emotional issue with the public - I remember receiving abusing phone calls from disgruntled customers when they couldn't get coverage in the middle of woop woop when they changed over. Apparently they got perfect reception everywhere on analogue.

There will always be some who will be disadvantaged by a network change, likewise there will always be some who actually gain from it. unfortunately we don't hear about those people who actually gain services.

now don't jump to attack me - I'm certainly not a fan of the big T, nor am I going to wade into whether next g is better etc. but I can tell you that politicians are in it for the exposure and not interested in competitive interests working to support regional consumers. if they were, then the big O would have received financial incentives to invest in regional and remote areas to set up a rival mobile network, and you would be able to vote with your feet (or wallets).

unfortunately, it is not financially viable which is why no one will tip money in. we Aussies think its a god given right that we have mobile coverage everywhere in Aus - we also want it cheap and we also want it to be perfect.

so in a nutshell, T's position is that it must provide the ducks nuts coverage, service and support and quality handsets - they must do it cheaply for the poor rural consumer - it must never fail nor offer slightly less coverage in any one area than before - and it will never return them a profit.

....and other companies can jump on the back of it for free (virtually) with no infrastructure required and make profits immediately when T dares to charge more.

I wouldn't operate a business under these circumstances, yet T must because of political involvement. not having a shot at anyone on this thread by the way. just an observation of the pressure T is under and the ridiculous operating environment they exist under considering they are no longer a public utility.