Help Please.....Tabs 4.65 territory pro - 60 hp enough?

[teammaher]

Hi all,

I ordered a Tabs 4.65 Territory Pro at a boat show last week with a 60 hp merc 4 st. Now being plate and having a 120 ltr fuel tank it is going to be a bit heavier than an equivalent quinny/stacer. I'm starting to wonder if the 60 will be enough motor for the boat. it is not to late to go bigger, but really don't want to spend to much more. the boat is rated to a 75 and was thinking a 75 optimax would be nice depending on price.

The hull weight is 510 kg

Not sure on max transom weight. 60 merc 4st is 112 kg, 75 4st is 181 kg and the 75 opti is 170 kg.

I asked the dealer about the 75 4st and he said it would sit to ar$e heavy with that motor and the 60 would be fine, but I'm just not sure.

Does anyone on here own one of these boats and if so what motor are you running?

I'm not disbelieving the dealer, however i would like some independent advice/feedback before parting with the CASH!

What do you reckon?

Thanks and Cheers,

Mabo.

[Dan5]

Mate the 70 suzi is 167kg if that's any help i had one on a 5mtr boat and it pushed it to 32kts and cruise at 23/4kts all day long.I've just put the 60hp yammie 4strk on a 4.5 bluefin i think that the merc/yammie share the same powerhead and the 60 is fine, your boat is about 100kg heavier but i reckon it would be about the same/similar performance as mine i get 30kts (my motor has only 8hrs on it)it will proberbly improve with a few more hour's on it.I know it's hard to part with cash when you usually never get to test drive your new boat first cos if you choose the wrong motor they don't refund them without a court case usally.I hope this help's you , Dan.............

[Dunco]

I'm waiting on a 4.6 plate boat as well (Different brand, no transom pod). The Yammy 60hp 4 st is what I was told to buy, only 115kg. The other option the builder gave me was a 70hp 2st. But it would be a bit noisier. He also suggested a Hydrofoil to get the ass out a bit quicker and help with turning.

The 75hp was to big for mine because there is no pod. But a Honda or a suzuki 4st only wiegh 165kg. I would think with the pod you should be OK with the extra 50kg. I guess it comes down to how fast you need to go???

I just checked the web site and the max is 138kg, and the 4.75 has the 75hp weight. I think you better stick with the 60hp

Either get a foil for it or talk to some people who have bought the Yammy 60hp High thrust model. Apparently if your worried about getting out of the water, they have a remedy with a larger prop.;)

[bushbeachboy]

You'd be much better off with a 75 than a 60. That is a heavy hull and it will run much better on a 75.

I always look at power-to-weight ratio with my boats, and I do it in Kg per Hp. That might not be a purist's way of doing it, but boats are weighed by Kg and motors are rated by Hp.

You can really only do it on the known, fixed weights, ie the hull weighs xx kg and the motor weighs yy kg etc. The fuel weight is variable, as is the load for each trip. For example with my little poly boat the hull is 265kg and the motor is 93kg giving me a total of 358kg with 40hp = 8.95kg per hp, and it's a nice matchup.

In your case the hull is 510kg and an Opti 75 is 170Kg = 680/75 = 9.06kg/hp.

If you work it out on a 60 at 112kg then you end up with 612/60 = 10.2kg/hp.

Remember that this is my way of working things out, not the only way or even the right way. But it works for me. My reasoning is that it only goes downhill from there weight wise, but all of the other weights are variable.

Hope this has suitable confused you.

Cheers

BBB

[Steve B]

Mabo,

Met a bloke at Awoonga a few years back with a 455 tabs side console. He had 60 4 stroke Yamaha and it had serious trouble getting on a plane with only 2 blokes in it. He wished he had of put a bigger motor on it.

Tip: I used to sell boats once and a true boaty once told me, Whatever size boat you think you need....go one size bigger, and put the biggest motor on it that it will take (legally of course) you wont have any regrets then.

For the record the resale will be much better with the bigger motor.

I have a 90 optimax on a 5m Makocraft Side console and its just enough!! If it could take bigger I would have done it. You wont regret an Optimax if you decide to go that way IMHO. Dont worry about it sitting heavy in the arse!! Good boat will handle that. and they are a good boat.

cheers steve

[Red60]

Hi Teammaher,

I have a Tabs 435 Territory tiller. Mine is pretty standard apart from a 55lb Minncota and 100ah deep cycle in the front deck. Max HP is 60 and min is 40 on the tiller. I too bought my boat from Regal Marine, about two years ago now. I went out for a test run in the 435 Territory with a 40Hp Merc two stroke, and it did feel a bit lacking. I went with the Merc 60Hp EFI four stroke. It was about 2K extra but I am glad I did.

The guy's are right the Tabs are built very well and therefore are heavier than most in a similar size. When you lift your floor you will see why, they are built like a brick outhouse.. My BMT on the weighbridge was 970Kg's. If you break that down the trailer is about 300kg's, and the engine 112kgs. So the hull loaded with gear a Minncota and deepcycle battery is 558Kgs, which is a bloody heavy boat. They also have a huge beam of 2.2m so that is a big boat to push through the water, especially when you look at them front on.

When I took delivery performance was very average, and I expected much more from a 60hp. It was extremely hard to get on the plane, which was dangerous on a stump riddled river as the nose would sit in the air for ages. Regal mounted my motor too low. You can't treat them like a pressed alloy boat. They need to be treated like a glass boat due to the weight and the cav plate needs to sit level with the bottom of the hull or you get heavy steering and poor performance. So I lifted it to the second last hole which helped significantly with the steering loads, and fitted a permatrim. The permatrim totaly transformed the boat. It planes significantly quicker. I am tempted to go up to the final hole but the guy's think it may cavitate. So far I have had no cavitation issues.

Top speed is really good but it still takes a little while to get there, and I am not overly wrapped with the acceleration. Once it winds up it really takes off but off the mark it is nothing special, or maybe I am just fussy. They fitted a standard Black Max 13 pitch prop. I am looking at getting a Merc Trophy Sport 12 pitch four blader soon to improve acceleration, as top speed is more than enough.

I have the 60 liter fuel tank and a full tank does make a difference. I would recommend you don't fill the 120 to the top unless you are planing to go via the coast to Sydney. The Merc EFI's are bloody fuel efficient, it took me months to empty that 60 liter tank. I only fill it half way now every five or so trips.

I would suggest that the hull weights Tabs publish are optimistic that your quoted "510 kg" is maybe a bare hull, without the timber floor, decks, console etc. I would send an email aksing Tabs directly to be sure if that weight is fully fitted out or bare hull. Mine only sits heavy on the arse when I get in, especially as it is a tiller. Your's being a console should be fine with a 75.

I was at the boatshow and I saw your model of boat on display. One thing that concerned me is the trailer was not fitted with brakes. Your BMT will be way over 750kg's so do not accept that deal without trailer brakes. Insist it is put on a weighbridge (with a full tank of fuel) if there is any hesitation. Mine was deliverd on a 750kg capacity trailer without brakes but I could tell from handling the boat a few times it was more than 750kg's. Curiosity got the better of me and I too it to my local weighbridge, which confirmed it. I went back to Regal that day and James happily changed the trailer for 1000kg's braked Dunbier Loader series trailer at no extra cost and paid the rego, so he was very helpfull. They did that on the day I showed up as he had one in under a boat.

The transducer braket on mine is mounted inline with the front strakes, which sends an airated path of water directly at the transducer. This means at speed you get poor signal display. Other owners of the bigger series of Tabs reported the same issues on various forums. I made a bracket and mounted my tranducer about 15cm to starboard to get around it. Not sure if they fixed this as yet, just let Regal know when they fit the sounder if you are getting one fitted to be aware of the front strakes when mounting the transducer.

I found Regal to be very good but Tabs very slack once the order was placed and the hull delivered. I ordered a lean seat afterwards, and touch up paint. After six months realised it was not going to arrive and have not heard anything in two years... Nedless to say I went and bought a lean seat some time ago. Make sure everything you want is in the order.

I would ask for a on water test with the 60 EFI if I were you. James will happily organise it and ensure it is a calm day so you can give it a good test. If the day is shit insist on another test day. Only then make a decision. You would not buy a car without a decent test drive. I think the 60HP would be sufficient if it is setup properly and has a decent prop like a Trophy Sport not a Black Max. 75 will give you a bit more of a smile factor especially if you are planning a bit of PPB work. I would probably go the Optimax due to the better torque low down which will help. If you are just doing fresh water lakes and rivers 60 might be okay.

Sorry for the lenghtly reply, but hope it helps..

Few pic's here:
http://stevedrazic.spaces.live.com/?_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaHandler=TWljcm9zb2Z0LlNwYWNlcy 5XZWIuUGFydHMuUGhvdG9BbGJ1bS5GdWxsTW9kZUNvbnRyb2xs ZXI%24&_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaFolderID=cns!16BCE3EE8118DF2F!1 38&_c11_PhotoAlbum_startingImageIndex=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_commentsExpand=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_addCommentExpand=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_addCommentFocus=0&_c=PhotoAlbum (http://stevedrazic.spaces.live.com/?_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaHandler=TWljcm9zb2Z0LlNwYWNlcy 5XZWIuUGFydHMuUGhvdG9BbGJ1bS5GdWxsTW9kZUNvbnRyb2xs ZXI%24&_c11_PhotoAlbum_spaFolderID=cns%2116BCE3EE8118DF2F %21138&_c11_PhotoAlbum_startingImageIndex=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_commentsExpand=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_addCommentExpand=0&_c11_PhotoAlbum_addCommentFocus=0&_c=PhotoAlbum)


Any questions yell out.

[teammaher]

Thanks guys for all the advice. :)

I have decided to go with the 75hp Optimax. Being that I live in the Northern Territory, I will be traveling vast distances on rivers and open waters to reach remote fishing/camp sites, and sometimes carrying considerable amounts of fishing/camping gear. Once I fully explained this to James at Regal Marine he agreed that the 75hp Opti would be the way to go.

I got a really good deal at the Melbourne Boat Show and can recommend to future buyers that waiting for a boat show can really pay off! Some may ask why buy in Melbourne when I live in the NT? Well the short answer is, east coast prices are cheaper than up here and transporting it here after picking it up isn't going to cost ME a cent due to my job.

For those that are interested the boat will be coming with the following options: 75hp Optimax
Hummingbird 787C Sounder/Plotter
Plumber front and rear tanks
Extended bow rails
Bow mount thruster plate
Bimini with rocket launcher
6 x rod and reals
Console with windscreen grab rail
VHF radio
Transom cutting board
Deck wash
Safety gear
Rego for trailer and boat (VIC)

Plus all standard features

Red 60 - the boat will be supplied on a mechanical braked trailer. James actually mentioned you at the boat show regarding your trailer and I think you taught them a lesson (but thanks for looking out for me).

Once again thanks for all the advice will post pics when I have the boat.

Cheers,

[Dan5]

Typically the boy's at abc marine would be more expensive,i've just moved from the territory to the east coast and have also bought a new boat and yes it is heap's cheaper here, also for me i would have to pay for transport cost's.You don't need that vic rego though no need for rego at home and you don't have to put those ugly bloody sticker's on ya new boat.See how much abc's servicing is compared to a southern dealer.Dan..

[Red60]

Well done Mabo,

Glad I could be of help. It will be nice with that Opti. Look forward to seeing some pic's.

[Ron173]

Teammaher,

If you can afford it, go the biggest HP you can, you dont have to use it, but its there if you wish to.

There will be days you were glad you did, also you will prob save fuel, as with the bigger motor you wont be running it so hard to get what you want out of it.

Just my 2 cents.

Ron

[jiffo]

My mate just put a 75 e-tec on a 4.35 tabs it goes faaaaaaassssssssttttttt. not sure of speed . but only rated to a 50hp.

[teammaher]

Jiffo,

Sounds like weapon. Is your mate not worried about the legalities of exceeding the max HP?

Cheers,

[sjp2]

thats what i was looking at- the 75 etec is only 138 kgs with about the same grunt as the opti,thats a lot of fuel for that size boat ,so you would want to save weight as much as possible,has the tabs got a wood floor still?

[teammaher]

SJP2,

Yes the tabs still has wooden floor. The fuel tank is very large, but it will alow me to carry all the fuel i need for a weeks fishing with out the need for jerry cans. I would have liked an E-tec, but the dealer is Merc only and from all reports the opti while a bit heavier is a craker of an engine, but time will tell.

Cheers,

[teammaher]

A couple of pics from the boat show. Just pretend its a 75 opti on the back and a black hull.

Cheers,

[teammaher]

and some more, I'll have the sounder and VHF mounted differently and a grab rail around the screen

[joe harrison]

hi i have 4.65 territory pro had trouble planning with 3 blokes and gear it was a merc prop 10.38x13p useless tryed my mates solas 11.6x11p new boat all together gets out of the hole straight away with 4 regular adults regal marines are all about your money not your new pride and joy you don,t get what you order and after sales service ?????? all about $$$$$

[geoffmck]

Great ad for Regal Marine. Swapping the trailer over without argument must have been a relief. Some dealers would definitely want more cash despite the legalities of what they had sold you.

I lashed out on a Stacer Seahorse 4.2 and Dunbier trailer back in 2005 from Regal Marine and can also vouch for their friendly, helpful approach. And the cheapest in town by miles, even on my small purchase.

Enjoy your new boat mate, I think you have made the right choice with the bigger HP for sure.

Cheer, Geoff